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2018 Discontinued Boats

125 posts in this topic

8 minutes ago, soldier4402 said:

yeah fuel prices will be the first indicator and will change things over night.  But without fuel prices I believe youll still see the bubble first if you look at certain indicators.  People have been keeping vehicles longer and taking longer notes on them the last few years according to some reports.  Also Factory rebates are trucks and suvs have been huge in the last few years. So I don't think you will see a huge burst like what fuel prices would do, but I forsee a market correction on these types of vehicles coming which I think its already happening in terms of the large factory rebates.

I think more than anything those large rebates just represent over priced MSRPs.   Make people think they're getting a great deal on a $60,000 truck by saving $10,000 on it.  I'd wager to guess that if those trucks were priced at $49,995 with no haggle prices instead of at $60,000 with $10,000 rebates, they'd sell a lot less of them.  Everyone I know that has bought a new truck recently has bragged about how much many they got off of sticker price.  Most are driving 4 dour pickups, cloth interior, 4x4, that they paid mid $30s for.  Hardly a bargain if you ask me.

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11 minutes ago, crvtt771 said:

I think more than anything those large rebates just represent over priced MSRPs.   Make people think they're getting a great deal on a $60,000 truck by saving $10,000 on it.  I'd wager to guess that if those trucks were priced at $49,995 with no haggle prices instead of at $60,000 with $10,000 rebates, they'd sell a lot less of them.  Everyone I know that has bought a new truck recently has bragged about how much many they got off of sticker price.  Most are driving 4 dour pickups, cloth interior, 4x4, that they paid mid $30s for.  Hardly a bargain if you ask me.

yes and no.  Those rebates were 20% off or more, so yeah definitely over priced MSRPs.  At 20% off that's way more then it used to be around 10% used to be a norm with 15% being really good, so its an indicator of a price correction.  Funny thing with trucks is you can get mid 30s truck that's the same mechanical wise as the 50's trucks only difference is leather a few gadgets and different wheel package.  Both have the same performance and otherwise get you to point a to b in the same fashion

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4 hours ago, newboat2016 said:

I looked at Cobalts seriously before I pulled the trigger on my new Tritoon.  They have several models "value priced" from the mid 40's to lower 50's, so they are mucy closer to the H2O lineup in price than they are to the  SSI line.

Cobalt has a bare bones line as well still overpriced at least the msrp is but I know they deal with much cheaper out the door pricing.  

I don't get the expensive lake boat thing on the under 10000 acre lakes.  You get a max of 90 days of summer here in my state.  I can't ever see buying new no matter our financial situation. Option up that single SSI on the website and it's a big number.  

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11 minutes ago, Chaparral Rider said:

Cobalt has a bare bones line as well still overpriced at least the msrp is but I know they deal with much cheaper out the door pricing.  

I don't get the expensive lake boat thing on the under 10000 acre lakes.  You get a max of 90 days of summer here in my state.  I can't ever see buying new no matter our financial situation. Option up that single SSI on the website and it's a big number.  

memorial to labor day in MI and NY both places I have lived and boated.  Your talking 12 weeks of boating per year give or take depending on how bold you are.  Take away bad weather weekends, plans you cant get out of, most people are lucky to get really 10 weekends or so.  Add up your note, insurance, fuel, and maint then divide by 10 makes each trip pretty expensive.

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52 minutes ago, soldier4402 said:

memorial to labor day in MI and NY both places I have lived and boated.  Your talking 12 weeks of boating per year give or take depending on how bold you are.  Take away bad weather weekends, plans you cant get out of, most people are lucky to get really 10 weekends or so.  Add up your note, insurance, fuel, and maint then divide by 10 makes each trip pretty expensive.

The good thing is we have an express cruiser and we spend nights on it.  The days are longer, so its easy to get out at night during the week.  But, yes, our season is pretty short. 

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Short season yes. If you feel the need to do the math, and justifiy owning a boat ,then it's probably time to find a different hobby than boating.

We backed out of boating for 2 seasons, and came right back. You only live once, can't take it with you, and time spent on the water with

family and friends is priceless. If you have the right boat, budget accordingly, the weekend dollars to use it are not worth worrying about.

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6 minutes ago, Rip5 said:

Short season yes. If you feel the need to do the math, and justifiy owning a boat ,then it's probably time to find a different hobby than boating.

We backed out of boating for 2 seasons, and came right back. You only live once, can't take it with you, and time spent on the water with

family and friends is priceless. If you have the right boat, budget accordingly, the weekend dollars to use it are not worth worrying about.

if you don't do the math for anything you buy and budget for it your either bill gates or probably need to take a look at what your doing.  Like you said hobbies are just that it can be biking boating or kitting doesn't matter.  All have a cost and we all make sacrifices to do those hobbies.  Everybody should take a look at cost for ownership and cost to run anybody tells you elsewise is probably foolish.  But if you spend to much time worrying about it then like you said its time to get out. 

My point above is more many of us that get 90 day seasons, the cost can be crazy per time up when you add everything, but as long as you budget for it and are happy with it so be it.  I cringe at some of these guys with the 7-800 per month payments, insurance, 200 bucks in fuel for the day, at what their cost per boating day is. 

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I am old & wiser.

I am running up huge boating bills.  I am copying Trumps life style.  Next month it is a Lear jet.    :haha-7383:

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16 hours ago, Rip5 said:

Short season yes. If you feel the need to do the math, and justifiy owning a boat ,then it's probably time to find a different hobby than boating.

We backed out of boating for 2 seasons, and came right back. You only live once, can't take it with you, and time spent on the water with

family and friends is priceless. If you have the right boat, budget accordingly, the weekend dollars to use it are not worth worrying about.

I'm with you Rip5, it's about smiles/dollar for me.

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On 9/6/2017 at 2:50 PM, Rip5 said:

Short season yes. If you feel the need to do the math, and justifiy owning a boat ,then it's probably time to find a different hobby than boating.

We backed out of boating for 2 seasons, and came right back. You only live once, can't take it with you, and time spent on the water with

family and friends is priceless. If you have the right boat, budget accordingly, the weekend dollars to use it are not worth worrying about.

Ha ha, I can't justify owning a 100k boat (which I realize isn't a lot of money in the boating world) for a 90 day max season when a 25k boat does what I need and looks decent.  I and many others don't have financial limitations like most folks have them just an overwhelming sense of practicality.  It means I buy another piece of property or investment with the 75k I didn't spend.  I also drive a 10 year old car as I can't justify commuting in something more where by again budget isn't the issue.   You can get away with older boats here because the do get so little use but cars are harder to keep because of the road salt. 

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10 hours ago, Chaparral Rider said:

 just an overwhelming sense of practicality.  It means I buy another piece of property or investment with the 75k I didn't spend.  I also drive a 10 year old car as I can't justify commuting in something more where by again budget isn't the issue.   You can get away with older boats here because the do get so little use but cars are harder to keep because of the road salt. 

Said it better than me and kind of what I was getting at.  Again to each their own and I could care less what my neighbor does and spends their money on.  But like you  I find practicality.  If I were to focus on boating and boating only, my budget would be pretty high, but then again it goes back to using it for 90 days only, and I could spend everything on a boat and skip out on trips, trailers, cars, and other things.  I decide to spread the wealth as boating is not a year round activity.  Plus like you said a 15 year old boat here maybe has 2-300hrs on it and cost 15-20k, looks the same as new, does the same as new.  But I have also subscribed to not becoming boat poor, house poor, snowmobile poor etc.  And when I say that I don't mean just financially I mean time invested and overall letting one thing consume to much time, money and effort at that point it gets stressful.

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if you are concerned with justifying the cost vs. usage of a boat, you're in the wrong activity.  Cause it'll never justify itself.  Unless maybe if you live in the far South and use your boat every day.

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28 minutes ago, MonkeySeaII said:

if you are concerned with justifying the cost vs. usage of a boat, you're in the wrong activity.  Cause it'll never justify itself.  Unless maybe if you live in the far South and use your boat every day.

disagree.  Because I can spend 20k on boat vs 40k and justify it all day long, I can do the same things on the 20k boat, be happy and comfortable and justify the usage but cant justify it with something twice the cost.  Conversely I can spend say 40k on wave runners because I know Ill use them every day vs buying a 20k boat that Ill use once a week, so I can  easily justify spending more money because of usage.  You can justify anything, I can set a entertainment budget and spend it all on boating or other things like going to the casino watching the movies etc.  But that's where opinion comes in and each person has their own idea on how to spend it, which is fine.  So I would counter with if you cant justify what your doing(albeit it might not make the financial sense at times but again what sort of entertainment makes sense) you probably shouldn't be doing it.

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I think you're both saying the same thing--it all boils down to how much value each individual places on enjoyment/entertainment.

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in my case, I live in PA where our season is basically May-Sept.  My kids are now heavily involved in sports so this year I only put about 25-30 hrs. on the boat.  We basically missed all of May and part of June due to travel tournaments.  Does it financially justify itself----No.  However, I wouldn't trade the days we do get out on the lake for anything because that family time on the water is priceless IMO.  Luckily, my boat has been paid off for the last 7 years so I don't have a payment.  But if I could afford the price of a new boat, I'd buy it in a heartbeat whether I use it 20 hrs. or 100 hrs./season.  What I'm trying to say is boating is not really an activity where you worry about the cost.

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A true boater does not care about the cost. I am glad my wife does not ask how much it costs to own/operate our Chaparral...

brick

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23 minutes ago, MonkeySeaII said:

  What I'm trying to say is boating is not really an activity where you worry about the cost.

Exactly!  At this point in my life, I choose to spend a large part of my entertainment "budget" on boating. Five years ago I spent it on golfing and belonging to the country club. Years before that I spent it in bars chasing women!  

Yes, I could "save" that money and choose to sit home and do nothing or something else cheaper, but this is the activity that I enjoy now. I pay my bills, have nice a nice home and cars,  have a few bucks in the bank, a good credit score, and feel reasonably comfortable that I have enough money to lead a decent life when it comes time to retire.   That's all the "justifying" I need to do!!!!

 

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1 hour ago, newboat2016 said:

Exactly!  At this point in my life, I choose to spend a large part of my entertainment "budget" on boating. Five years ago I spent it on golfing and belonging to the country club. Years before that I spent it in bars chasing women!  

Yes, I could "save" that money and choose to sit home and do nothing or something else cheaper, but this is the activity that I enjoy now. I pay my bills, have nice a nice home and cars,  have a few bucks in the bank, a good credit score, and feel reasonably comfortable that I have enough money to lead a decent life when it comes time to retire.   That's all the "justifying" I need to do!!!!

 

The bummer of having a few possessions and a couple bucks in the bank is college for the kids will cost you full retail as a start.  That's our next big investment.  

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Well, I think too that cost shouldn't be a concern about boating. Boating is a family hobby and it is a way to enjoy moments with the people you love not an end in itself.

When I was in Florida last year, I saw a lot of people showing off their car/boat/bikes etc...They have a boat to own it and show it, not really for themselves or to create moments with their love ones, IMO, it is kind of sad..

But as Jeffk said in another thread, it is about what makes you happy and we are all happy with our boat I guess... starting to count how many dollars I have spent on the boat is just useless for me, unless you are able to quantify the smile of your son/daughter/wife (which I can't). I am counting for my company already I think it is enough :P 

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45 minutes ago, Chaparral Rider said:

The bummer of having a few possessions and a couple bucks in the bank is college for the kids will cost you full retail as a start.  That's our next big investment.  

Luckily, my daughter (only child) is out of college and totally self sufficient.  She did have some student loans which served as a good start to her credit history and helped her understand responsibility of "real life" after college.  I'm fortunate that I was able to help her with college, and when she was finished I told her I'd help her pay her loans.  As of today, her totally student loan balance is about $8k and will be fully paid in a year or so. 

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46 minutes ago, newboat2016 said:

Luckily, my daughter (only child) is out of college and totally self sufficient.  She did have some student loans which served as a good start to her credit history and helped her understand responsibility of "real life" after college.  I'm fortunate that I was able to help her with college, and when she was finished I told her I'd help her pay her loans.  As of today, her totally student loan balance is about $8k and will be fully paid in a year or so. 

Good deal.  College can be stressful for parents and adults, but I don't think necessarily has to be.  If kids pick the logical school for a degree that they want to do, mom and dad help some, kid works some and takes a few loans, after 4 years the dent really wont be that bad.  Kids can also look for athletic and scholastic scholarships, work jobs in the dorm that give them discounted or free rates on things plus money in the bank.  Most public colleges are around 15k a year with room and board, that's a 60k education, mom and dad pay a third, kid pays a third while in college and take a third on loan, it's really not that big of a deal.  I know multiple people that worked off this formula one way or another and graduated with less than 10k in loans.

The idea that kids will pick a 30-40k a year college and contribute nothing to it and leave me the entirety of the bill just wont happen in our house, didn't happen when I grew up.  Just sets a bad precedence of how adult life will really be.  Plus gets their credit going and teaches them the concept of borrowing.

 

 

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28 minutes ago, soldier4402 said:

Good deal.  College can be stressful for parents and adults, but I don't think necessarily has to be.  If kids pick the logical school for a degree that they want to do, mom and dad help some, kid works some and takes a few loans, after 4 years the dent really wont be that bad.  Kids can also look for athletic and scholastic scholarships, work jobs in the dorm that give them discounted or free rates on things plus money in the bank.  Most public colleges are around 15k a year with room and board, that's a 60k education, mom and dad pay a third, kid pays a third while in college and take a third on loan, it's really not that big of a deal.  I know multiple people that worked off this formula one way or another and graduated with less than 10k in loans.

The idea that kids will pick a 30-40k a year college and contribute nothing to it and leave me the entirety of the bill just wont happen in our house, didn't happen when I grew up.  Just sets a bad precedence of how adult life will really be.  Plus gets their credit going and teaches them the concept of borrowing.

 

 

scariest part is now some of these schools are 60K+.  That's just insane!  We started college funds for both our kids when they were born so hopefully they will be set when the time comes.  We were in DC a few weeks ago and my 13 yr. old wanted to see Georgetown U.  Holy crap, 65K!!  That aint happening!!

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1 hour ago, MonkeySeaII said:

scariest part is now some of these schools are 60K+.  That's just insane!  We started college funds for both our kids when they were born so hopefully they will be set when the time comes.  We were in DC a few weeks ago and my 13 yr. old wanted to see Georgetown U.  Holy crap, 65K!!  That aint happening!!

yeah the privates can be super high.  think Harvard and alike are over 100k a year, but money alone doesn't get you in there.  Luckily most public schools are still under 10k a year minus books and housing.  And community colleges are half of that for a year.  Cost is astronomical for sure still its crazy.  But again its about being smart about choices and putting some onus on the kid as well.  I shake my head with our friends kids going to a 30-40k a year private school to be a grade school teacher, when they could get the same degree and the same job for half the cost down the road at a public school.  Again to each their own I guess.  We started funds as well when they were born, it wont be enough to cover it all unless the market goes wild, but then again we never planned to cover it all by design, want to give them some ownership on things ultimately this is for them not me.  But there will be enough to ensure they get some help.

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3 hours ago, Chaparral Rider said:

The bummer of having a few possessions and a couple bucks in the bank is college for the kids will cost you full retail as a start.  That's our next big investment.  

Just finished two kids through college and one graduate degree. I can breathe again...

brick

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9 minutes ago, brick said:

Just finished two kids through college and one graduate degree. I can breathe again...

brick

feels good I bet

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