watson524

How much water in boat?

36 posts in this topic

Hi all,

Had to new boat out on it's second outing today so I'll be posting a few questions. The first being around water in the boat.

We had the bow and cockpit cover on and Saturday and Sunday it rained cats and dogs. The bow cover comes up under the windshield opening and snaps there so we didn't have the "normal" amount of water coming in but.... We noticed concerning water/dampness in several areas:

1.) In the "closet" in front of the helm, the table holder bracket was damp. Nothing was damp forward near the amp or at the helm wall at the fuses but I thought this was odd. Wondering if it was because the humidity spiked up and it was warm today so maybe that's why we saw it on the metal bracket and not from water getting in? I have no idea how it'd get in there anyway (short of the speedo tube culprit which is not an issue)

2.) We have the wetbar option. I had a notebook and pen in the small compartment there under the sink and it was soaked. Where the cooler/trash can go was only a little damp. There was no pooling of water but the notebook was soaked through. I know this is right near the arch base which is a notorious area for water intrusion so my guess is something came in and I thought ran down under the sink or maybe more likely where the sprayer for the "faucet" comes up? Anyone else experience this? 

3.) The floor drains in the back corners when we pulled out of dock I noticed standing water right under the top of them. When we came back to dock, the starboard side area had a lake forming around the drain and up towards the wet bar. Turns out the seacocks to drain each of those were closed so when we opened them, the water drained out but my question here is where did MORE water come from into these lines during our ride if those seacocks were closed? We left them open while at the dock but I suppose there's different opinions on this.

4.) In the bilge...... How much water is expected in the bilge? Our old boat would stay bone dry tho we had a full mooring cover. When I opened the hatch to do the fluids check, I was shocked at the amount of water in the bottom. The float switch and pump is right up towards the front of the bilge. I actually thought maybe it was wired goofy so when the batteries were off, it wouldn't work but I verified it's ok by lifting the switch. I lifted and a little bit did come out overboard (and water sprayed out 2 sides of the pump which I've never seen before and not sure if it means anything) but then stopped before it was  dry. It seems to be mounted as low as it can be and not up high on a bracket but the water was up to the height of the first "step" in the hull, if that makes sense.

5.) I noticed that in the ski locker there's a plug installed. In my old boat, there was no plug and that locker drained to the bilge. Does this not work the same way? Why would that plug on a chain be there?

6.) As we were driving at low speeds trying to learn how to use the trim and tabs to affect position in the water, I noticed that water was coming up on the swim platform. I know in the center is that cut out and water can get in there. I know the port side has the cooler that drains back under the transom by the outdrive. What happens for water that gets in between the top and bottom of the swim platform (i.e. in that cutout etc). Does that just drain back into the bilge? It seems like it would but I want to be sure.

All this being said, we'll be putting our typical damp rid buckets in key areas. They really helped in the old boat and we never had mildew but seeing how things work now, it's just raising a bunch of questions.

thanks!

 

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1 hour ago, watson524 said:

1.) In the "closet" in front of the helm, the table holder bracket was damp. Nothing was damp forward near the amp or at the helm wall at the fuses but I thought this was odd. Wondering if it was because the humidity spiked up and it was warm today so maybe that's why we saw it on the metal bracket and not from water getting in? I have no idea how it'd get in there anyway (short of the speedo tube culprit which is not an issue)

I am not sure how it would get wet in the storage closet.  I have never seen it wet in there on mine.

1 hour ago, watson524 said:

2.) We have the wetbar option. I had a notebook and pen in the small compartment there under the sink and it was soaked. Where the cooler/trash can go was only a little damp. There was no pooling of water but the notebook was soaked through. I know this is right near the arch base which is a notorious area for water intrusion so my guess is something came in and I thought ran down under the sink or maybe more likely where the sprayer for the "faucet" comes up? Anyone else experience this? 

I use just the bow and cockpit covers as well.  When it rains hard, my garbage can fills with water so I know water is leaking in from the top down in to that area.  Usually, though, the little storage compartment stays dry.  I often time put ice in the sink, and the condensation that forms on the bottom of the sink will drip in to the storage compartment, though.  I would double check your sink drain and faucet and see if water is getting in through them.  

1 hour ago, watson524 said:

3.) The floor drains in the back corners when we pulled out of dock I noticed standing water right under the top of them. When we came back to dock, the starboard side area had a lake forming around the drain and up towards the wet bar. Turns out the seacocks to drain each of those were closed so when we opened them, the water drained out but my question here is where did MORE water come from into these lines during our ride if those seacocks were closed? We left them open while at the dock but I suppose there's different opinions on this.

I have always left mine open.  Not sure where more water would have come from, but when under way a lot of stuff flows towards the stern :)

1 hour ago, watson524 said:

4.) In the bilge...... How much water is expected in the bilge? Our old boat would stay bone dry tho we had a full mooring cover. When I opened the hatch to do the fluids check, I was shocked at the amount of water in the bottom. The float switch and pump is right up towards the front of the bilge. I actually thought maybe it was wired goofy so when the batteries were off, it wouldn't work but I verified it's ok by lifting the switch. I lifted and a little bit did come out overboard (and water sprayed out 2 sides of the pump which I've never seen before and not sure if it means anything) but then stopped before it was  dry. It seems to be mounted as low as it can be and not up high on a bracket but the water was up to the height of the first "step" in the hull, if that makes sense.

Its from the rain.  While we do not get much here, when it does rain it rains hard (2-3 times a year).  I suspect on mine it is from water going down in to the cooler area (see above, my garbage can always has 4-6 inches of water in it after a hard rain) and that ends up in the bilge.  When I first got the boat, seemed like a there was too much water in there from just using the boat, no rain.  Although people say not to, I pulled the plug, wrapped the threads in teflon tape, put it back in and no issues with water in the bilge now, except when it rains.

 

1 hour ago, watson524 said:

5.) I noticed that in the ski locker there's a plug installed. In my old boat, there was no plug and that locker drained to the bilge. Does this not work the same way? Why would that plug on a chain be there?

You should remove that plug and let any water draining in to the center ski lock drain in to the bilge, in my opinion.  I have never put that plug in.  Not sure what reason I would have to do so.

1 hour ago, watson524 said:

6.) As we were driving at low speeds trying to learn how to use the trim and tabs to affect position in the water, I noticed that water was coming up on the swim platform. I know in the center is that cut out and water can get in there. I know the port side has the cooler that drains back under the transom by the outdrive. What happens for water that gets in between the top and bottom of the swim platform (i.e. in that cutout etc). Does that just drain back into the bilge? It seems like it would but I want to be sure.

I have the old platform that does not have the vent.  And that is what it is, a vent.  Water coming up through it is normal and nothing to be worried about.  It prevents that swim platform from smacking down and creating an air pocket it is a bit rough out, thus making a lot of noise.  With the vent, that does not happen.  There is no drain for it, it just runs off the swim platform either back down the vent and out the bottom or off the sides.

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1.) The carpet wasn't wet at all even up the sides so I'm really wondering if it was condensation from cold metal and the humidity. I noticed condensation on the engine block and manifolds too that I figure was the same thing (our weather has been dumb) - I'll just keep an eye on it.

2.) I'll check out the sink and hose fittings there but my guess is it's rain around the arch and maybe dripping in where the faucet comes out. Don't take this the wrong way but it's good to know you have the issue too in that area.

3.) Those floor drains are a mystery on how more stuff came in so I'm going to keep an eye on it but I'm going to do what you do and keep the drains open

4.) On our old boat, I was a teflon wrapper too, this one went in the water at the dealer and we just drove it down to the dock since I have no reason to pull it yet. The dealer has the trailer because they'll take it out before the holiday for when they do the carpet so maybe I'll wrap it the plug then. I just do NOT like the idea of standing water there so I may have to suck it out and keep an eye on it. When I was sitting in the back as my husband was driving and I was looking at the water coming up on the platform, I wondered if maybe some would be dripping to the bilge through the platform "vent" but I guess it shouldn't be.

5.) I'll take the ski locker plug out the next time I'm at the boat. I even got a spare in the "care package" along with two plugs for the bow and platform "coolers". Not sure why anyone would want to plug those either unless you want to use one for ice water

6.) The water wasn't coming up through the vent it was more coming over the end of the platform. We were going slow enough that water was "following" us from the wake. It was kind of cool to watch actually. But now that you say it, I didn't think that "vent" went all the way through. In looking at it, it looks like the bottom is solid and the top is vented. But if that's the case, then wouldn't the water stuck in there just come forward into the bilge area? I'm hoping water doesn't just sit in the innards of the platform.

 

We put the full mooring cover on to get it stretched out and all and like my friend's Malibu which was my first experience with a tower I can see the leaking around the base will be worse than with the bow and cockpit because nothing clinches or seals around it and it flaps open so my guess is we'll use the bow and cockpit more 

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I believe if you look under the swim platform you will see the bottom of the vent and screws holding it in?  But I am not sure, since I do not have one.  But maybe someone else with a newer 264 can chime in, or I believe the 256 had the vent standard as well for all years?

On rare occasions we have a lot of people out and I use the bow built in cooler, I use the plug.  Ice does not last long in our heat.  But ice water last longer lol!  I have not looked but I am thinking of trying to replace the wet bar cooler with a Yeti or something similar.  That cooler does not keep ice very well either in the summer.

I have been thinking for a few years on getting a mooring cover.  I would prefer a factory one, but they are black.  And black will not work here at all.   My old boat had black covers and the heat ended up discoloring the vinyl.  Sometimes boat makers are too in to looks, and not functionality :)  But then again, I live in an extreme area as far as summer.  But we make up for it with year around boating and no winterizing!

I am probably going to have one made this winter when I get some vinyl work done.  8 years (9 including this coming summer) in the sun and heat and I have a few "burn" spots on the Blue inserts (it is like a metallic blue) that I need to have replaced.  No matter how much you wash, wax, clean, protect the sun will win, eventually.  Especially when 115+ degrees is not uncommon down at the lake in the summer.  The white and grey have held up well and look like new.  But any darkish color down here gets blasted bad.

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My 186 has several ice melters. No keep coolers. I think there is 0 foam insulation around the inner hull plastic molding assembly. Should be very little space available for foam.

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Never had a boat stay bone dry 100% in all situations.  But with that said some ways to mitigate water is A. have a good cover, a full boat cover cockpit covers and such only go so far.  If you store the boat out of water always pull the drain plug or plugs and ensure the front of the boat is higher then the rear.  Check all drains and hoses that lead to the orfices on the outside of the boat, these can get clogged.

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1 hour ago, cyclops2 said:

My 186 has several ice melters. No keep coolers. I think there is 0 foam insulation around the inner hull plastic molding assembly. Should be very little space available for foam.

Our platform cooler has some silver skinned sheets stuck around it for whatever it's worth. Don't know about the bow cooler and I can't remember what I saw at that stage at the factory tour

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I get a lot of water under my cover on the starboard side right behind the arch.  It goes down into the storage compartment under the seat and ends up down in the bilge.  I also get water under the bow cover at the windshield.  Unfortunately the covers are a complete seal.  But for the most part the boat stays pretty dry

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I too get a fair amount of water come in at the bow cover windshield snap area. Seems like with the support pole up, it creates a downslope back to the windshield area.

I would suggest when you get it home on a nice day, uncover the boat and open up all doors, lids and cabinets and engine compartment and just let it air out real well.

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3 hours ago, watson524 said:

Our platform cooler has some silver skinned sheets stuck around it for whatever it's worth. Don't know about the bow cooler and I can't remember what I saw at that stage at the factory tour

The bow cooler has some insulation wrapped around it, or should anyway according to the parts guide pictures.  But it really does not do much as we all know.

I use my swim platform one to store ski and wakeboard ropes in :)

 

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20 hours ago, dsmacey said:

I believe if you look under the swim platform you will see the bottom of the vent and screws holding it in?  But I am not sure, since I do not have one.  But maybe someone else with a newer 264 can chime in, or I believe the 256 had the vent standard as well for all years?

I have been thinking for a few years on getting a mooring cover.  I would prefer a factory one, but they are black.  And black will not work here at all.   My old boat had black covers and the heat ended up discoloring the vinyl.  Sometimes boat makers are too in to looks, and not functionality :)  But then again, I live in an extreme area as far as summer.  But we make up for it with year around boating and no winterizing!

Since we're in the water, I can't look under but when they pull it to put in the carpet or the 20 hour, I'll have a look see. 

On the mooring cover, I'm used to canvas and this is a nylon so I'll have to see how it does. I can see how black won't cut it for you but year round boating sounds GREAT!!

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9 hours ago, Chap243 said:

I too get a fair amount of water come in at the bow cover windshield snap area. Seems like with the support pole up, it creates a downslope back to the windshield area.

I would suggest when you get it home on a nice day, uncover the boat and open up all doors, lids and cabinets and engine compartment and just let it air out real well.

We're in a slip until October (except to pull a few times for cleaning usually) but I figure when it's nice and we're sitting at the dock I can have it opened up. I'm fairly impressed with the fact we didn't have a lake in it today after the monsoon-like storm that went through here (tho we didn't take the full cover off to check under the engine).

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I have a Sunesta 224 but many of these issue are common for all the Chappy runabouts.

Bilge - I too had dry as a bone bilges in my previous boats but have just gotten used to having some water in the bilge with this brand.  

Floor Locker Drain - On the 224 it's a very poor design as the bilge backwashes under the gas tank into the floor locker, so it's a catch 22 with keeping that drain open.  The locker is about even w/ the bilge floor and with the drain fitting the locker can't drain completely.  In fact on mine I had issues with the cavity below the ski locker floor holding water due to cracks in the ski locker floor - after two service visits we ended up making the fiberglass repairs but also installing an access hatch to easily inspect or dry out in the future.  Also the   ski locker lid scupper drains into the ski locker rather than the bilge creating even more water in the locker.

Windshield Cover Leaks - As stated earlier the bow cover creates a slope back to the windshield and the cover doesn't have enough lip or coverage to keep water out.  Someone on this forum posted the idea of putting a slit in a float noodle cut to fit on the helm console door that closes off the bow walk thru.  That puts enough pressure on the cover and the bottom of the walk thru window to reduce the amount of water that leaks through. 

Leaks at Bimini top mount near entertainment center - Similar to your arch I bet, the cover on my boat creates a funnel as it doesn't seal where the bimini arch folds up causing water to flow onto the entertainment center.  Into the sink is fine as that drains overboard but a lot goes into the trash chute and into the trash can.  I end up wrapping a towel around those supports and also putting a towel under the trash chute cover to soak / plug that area up a bit.

I'm looking now at having a customer mooring cover and/or one piece (over the windshield) cockpit/bow cover made.  

Hope this helps!

 

 

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10 minutes ago, jhole said:

Bilge - I too had dry as a bone bilges in my previous boats but have just gotten used to having some water in the bilge with this brand.  

I guess I have to figure out what amount is ok as "some". I almost feel like I want to move the float/pump further down/back but I don't know if that's even possible so I'll have to take a closer look.

10 minutes ago, jhole said:

Also the   ski locker lid scupper drains into the ski locker rather than the bilge creating even more water in the locker.

What do you mean by the lid scupper?

10 minutes ago, jhole said:

Windshield Cover Leaks - As stated earlier the bow cover creates a slope back to the windshield and the cover doesn't have enough lip or coverage to keep water out.  Someone on this forum posted the idea of putting a slit in a float noodle cut to fit on the helm console door that closes off the bow walk thru.  That puts enough pressure on the cover and the bottom of the walk thru window to reduce the amount of water that leaks through. 

That sounds like a good idea, I might look into it since I have some pre-slit pipe insulation laying around. Tho I do like how they have the bow cover go up under the windshield which does help vs some other covers I've seen.

10 minutes ago, jhole said:

Leaks at Bimini top mount near entertainment center - Similar to your arch I bet, the cover on my boat creates a funnel as it doesn't seal where the bimini arch folds up causing water to flow onto the entertainment center.  Into the sink is fine as that drains overboard but a lot goes into the trash chute and into the trash can.  I end up wrapping a towel around those supports and also putting a towel under the trash chute cover to soak / plug that area up a bit.

Once it stops raining, I'm going to take a look at the sink area and see how that seals and such to see where/how water is getting down into that small storage area. It's all caulked at the top so it seems weird that we have it going there vs the cooler side.

10 minutes ago, jhole said:

I'm looking now at having a customer mooring cover and/or one piece (over the windshield) cockpit/bow cover made.  

If you have the arch, pay particular attention to how you are doing to seal things around that is all I can say there.

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To clarify about the ski locker, there is a drainage channel that the hinged hatch sits down into.  When water gets into the floor of the boat via rain or wash down, a good bit of water runs into that channel which has a drain and via a hose is directed into the ski locker. (at least on my boat)  I'm looking to try and reroute that hose through the bulkhead and into the bilge as my next project.  I can deal w/ the bilge being wet all the time but the ski locker on mine is constantly wet for a variety of reasons and trying to dry that up.  For example if I can reroute the above, I can perhaps then plug the drain hole from locker to bilge and avoid back flow.   

Re: The Sink - On mine the counter lid that covers the trash receptacle has no sealing so any water on that counter drains right thru and into the trash can below and sometimes into the storage area.  I may try installing a rubber gasket around that hole so when lid is closed the water will drain around and into the cockpit....still a work in progress!

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It seems between boats and Travel trailers the small things aren't well thought out.  It seems the builders are usually pretty good at making the shells of boats and trailers but the internal engineering on items tends to be terrible.  I don't know if that's if the worst engineers work for them, they lack CAD and other design software or my guess is their R&D or testing on these sorts of things is actually very minimal.  Also doesn't help in this day and age cheap plastic materials are used rampantly and nothing is designed to last forever anymore. 

 

Ive always said with boats and trailers that I have owned, didn't the company build a prototype and hand it out to joe blow to use for a week and right down all the bad things he didn't like about it.

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55 minutes ago, jhole said:

To clarify about the ski locker, there is a drainage channel that the hinged hatch sits down into.  When water gets into the floor of the boat via rain or wash down, a good bit of water runs into that channel which has a drain and via a hose is directed into the ski locker. (at least on my boat)  I'm looking to try and reroute that hose through the bulkhead and into the bilge as my next project.  I can deal w/ the bilge being wet all the time but the ski locker on mine is constantly wet for a variety of reasons and trying to dry that up.  For example if I can reroute the above, I can perhaps then plug the drain hole from locker to bilge and avoid back flow.   

Re: The Sink - On mine the counter lid that covers the trash receptacle has no sealing so any water on that counter drains right thru and into the trash can below and sometimes into the storage area.  I may try installing a rubber gasket around that hole so when lid is closed the water will drain around and into the cockpit....still a work in progress!

Got it, I was wondering if you meant the channel. I'll have to look at ours and see where that lip drains to when I'm back over at the boat. Noah is in my backyard building an ark at the moment so.....  How much  backflow do you get from the bilge to the locker? Makes me think maybe I will keep that plug in there since I have life jackets in there and I don't want them to get moldy (even tho we have a damp rid bucket in that locker)

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Swim platform top vent vertically connects directly to two round vents on the underneath of the platform on 264. 

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Wet spots can be a frustrating thing to track down.  My previous chap never had even a hint of water in the bilge but the current one has me flummoxed.  I think for me it is a failing transducer seal which I just fixed.  We shall see if that corrects it when I launch for the year.  Sounds like you have a lot going on to track down.  I do like how your mind does what mine does and you mitigate it to the least worst possible issue in your assessment.  For you, that's probably the case, for my old girl, it usually isn't.  

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If your boat sits in the slip, uncovered ( without a roof overhead) I might suggest getting a good mooring cover to put on it when you leave. It will definitely do a better job of keeping the water out during heavy rains over the bow and cockpit covers.

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On 5/16/2018 at 2:30 PM, jhole said:

To clarify about the ski locker, there is a drainage channel that the hinged hatch sits down into.  When water gets into the floor of the boat via rain or wash down, a good bit of water runs into that channel which has a drain and via a hose is directed into the ski locker. (at least on my boat) 

I looked at ours and that drain hose from the lip goes aft and I assume comes out in the bilge.

3 hours ago, Chap243 said:

If your boat sits in the slip, uncovered ( without a roof overhead) I might suggest getting a good mooring cover to put on it when you leave. It will definitely do a better job of keeping the water out during heavy rains over the bow and cockpit covers.

We have the mooring cover for it and I was pleasantly surprised how dry things were when we went today after all the rain, we put it on after we were out on Monday. Not totally dry, but with the arch, that's not expected. Nothing in our trash can, a bit of water dripped down under the sink in the small compartment, but nothing major. The cover is relaxing a bit so when we put it on just now we were able to snug things up a bit more. We wanted both cover options so that if we're going out multiple days in a row or I'm out by myself I can put the bow/cockpit covers on since the full mooring cover is a bit tough for one person.

 

The water in the bilge that we never had with the old one is still interesting to me but it didn't get higher, it seems like just a level it sits at that the pump can't get to. Ready to go in there with a turkey baster and suck it out lol!

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I use a small (6 gal) shop vac to get the water out that the bulge pump can’t.  I have a 244 and like yours the bilge pump doesn’t go very far back under engine.

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2 minutes ago, Lestat said:

I use a small (6 gal) shop vac to get the water out that the bulge pump can’t.  I have a 244 and like yours the bilge pump doesn’t go very far back under engine.

Unfortunately, I don't have power at the dock. I should see if Dewalt makes something since we have a bunch of their 20v tools. Our pump sits almost in line with the front of the engine.

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20 minutes ago, watson524 said:

Unfortunately, I don't have power at the dock. I should see if Dewalt makes something since we have a bunch of their 20v tools. Our pump sits almost in line with the front of the engine.

I have a decent Dewalt battery powered vac.  Also can use it corded.  Not a ton of run time but with a couple of batts it's not bad.

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Get a power inverter. I have a 1000w one hard wired into the boat that I use to power a 2hp shop vac. Shop vac is hard plumbed into the port side hold in the main cockpit. Use it to clean up and inflate the big toys.

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